Economics Explored

Have We Gone Too Far on Free Trade?

Episode Summary

Free trade has long been a cornerstone of economic thinking, but is it still fit for purpose in a more dangerous and uncertain world? Gene Tunny is joined by Dan Ryan and John Humphreys to debate tariffs, industrial policy, and economic resilience. They explore whether Australia has gone too far in opening its economy, the risks of fragile global supply chains, and the perceived trade-offs between efficiency and national security.

Episode Notes

Free trade has long been a cornerstone of economic thinking, but is it still fit for purpose in a more dangerous and uncertain world? Gene Tunny is joined by Dan Ryan and John Humphreys to debate tariffs, industrial policy, and economic resilience. They explore whether Australia has gone too far in opening its economy, the risks of fragile global supply chains, and the perceived trade-offs between efficiency and national security. 

Dan Ryan is Executive Director of the National Conservative Institute of Australia, and John Humphreys is Chief Economist at the Australian Taxpayers’ Alliance. 

Gene would love to hear your thoughts on this episode. You can email him via contact@economicsexplored.com. 

Takeaways

1. Free trade generally boosts living standards but may also introduce vulnerabilities in a geopolitically unstable world.
2. Tariffs can protect domestic industries, but they also raise prices and risk economic inefficiency.
3. Supply chain resilience is emerging as a key policy concern, alongside cost efficiency.
4. Deindustrialisation is driven not just by trade, but also by automation and energy costs.
5. There may be a middle ground: limited, targeted trade restrictions for national security rather than broad protectionism.

Timestamps

• 00:00 – Introduction: Free trade under pressure
• 02:45 – Why Australia lost refining capacity
• 03:40 – Supply chains and geopolitical risk
• 05:40 – What does “cheapest” really mean?
• 07:30 – Do tariffs encourage local production?
• 10:35 – Automation vs trade in deindustrialisation
• 13:05 – Energy costs and competitiveness
• 15:15 – Is reindustrialisation realistic?
• 18:15 – What tariffs would actually look like
• 20:30 – Dan’s case for a 10% tariff baseline
• 22:15 – Can tariffs replace income taxes?
• 25:10 – Historical tariffs in Australia
• 27:30 – Are tariffs just another tax?
• 28:25 – Would tariffs really bring jobs back?
• 30:50 – Technology vs trade: what matters more?
• 33:15 – Tariffs, revenue, and economic trade-offs
• 36:00 – Final reflections: trade vs national security

Links relevant to the conversation

Australian Taxpayers’ Alliance livestream, Thursday 16 April:

https://www.youtube.com/live/fyukScFysDs?si=FwDjygolodDUQVRz

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